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Narfi's Life after EU: Chapter Three - 14' Hiawatha Canoe

Discussion in 'Life, the Universe and Everything' started by narfi, Aug 16, 2017.

  1. narfi

    narfi Lost

    The goal behind building the 14' Hiawatha Canoe is twofold.
    1. It will help me learn the details to building a boat this way, (stitch and glue) In preparation for building a larger powered boat.
    2. It will be a great little boat for Landon to enjoy now while the larger one is being built, at 7yrs old he can go out in a canoe or kayak 'on his own', I wouldn't let him take a powered boat for several more years :P

    http://bateau.com/studyplans/HC14_study.php?prod=HC14
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I chose the HC14 model because it is designed by the same guy who designed the power boat I will be building. I chose the 14' model instead of the 12 or 16' models because of estimated weight we will have in the boat, you dont want too heavy because it will sit low and sluggish, you dont want to light because you will sit too high and become unstable. (you can regain the stability by using some sort of ballast like rocks in the bottom when only one person etc... but that would be a pain)

    upload_2017-8-15_17-37-1.
    upload_2017-8-15_17-38-22.

    upload_2017-8-15_17-38-57.

    hehe..... I would soon discover that my desires and skills did not come anywhere close to those expectations.........

    I think with experience, and starting with cnc cut panels, AND no fairing, just stitch, glue, epoxy the glass tapes on and paint could be done in that. It would be a seaworthy canoe and structurally sound, but it would not be pretty.

    I cut out the panels myself from the plans, and want it to be a good looking boat for years to come. Combine that with the fact I have never worked with wood before, and very marginal experience with composites, and never on boats, you can imagine it is taking me much much longer :)
     
  2. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 8, 2017

    The hc14 does NOT call for a Strong back so I would like to present one made from 2x8s.........
    20170707_232023 (Medium). Reality is I used all my scrap 2x6s I was planning to use under my tent frame poles and didnt have any left for the strongback. So I just used these scrap 2x8s I had from tearing down my porch.

    The tent floor is uneven and not level so I figured I would make the Strong back for my fs17 early and get it leveled to use as the table for the hc14.

    Plan on putting 6 legs under it tomorow and getting it good and level and square.
    Will use either 4x4s or 2x8s for the legs and sheet the top with 1/2" scrap plywood.

    10am overcast Saturday morning. Weather station at my work 3/4 mile away is reporting 55f

    I don't have an outside thermometer or one for my tent.... will look on Amazon.


    Got the legs on and the steongback squared and leveled.
    Then sheeted the top of it with 3/4" plywood.
    20170708_140722 (Medium).
    Finally some fun stuff.

    Marked the plywood centerline and 24inch lines then marked the lines and used small finishing nails and a thin strip of wood to trace the curves.

    There were two measurements missing from the plans but searching the forum found them for me.

    The nice thing about sheeting the strongback with old plywood is I don't care about scarring it up with the saw.

    I've never really worked with wood before so kind of learning as I go. I think it's going ok so far though.
    20170708_152357 (Medium). 20170708_154404 (Medium). 20170708_155250 (Medium). 20170708_210253 (Medium).

    Opened up my first bottles of marinepoxy and got 3 pumps setup, one in the resin and one in a fast and one in a medium hardener.

    Mixed way to much for what I needed. Did 8 pumps of resin and 2 of each fast/medium hardener.
    Mixed it thouraly and then poured some in a second cup and mixed wood flour in with it.

    Applied the thickened resin between each of the seams and got them aligned well and wiped the excess off.

    Then with a brush coated the plywood each side of the seam and layed the tape down and worked more resin in in till it was saturated.

    I layed wax butcher paper under and over each seam and then a strip of plywood with weight on it. Hopefully they cure evenly without any warps.

    I realized after I was done that the paper wasn't as waxy as I thought.... may have to sand it off tomorow... will find out.

    I ended up needing a little more resin so did 2 pumps of resin and 1 of fast.
    I made Way too much "glue" and it was getting hot and hard by The time I was done....
    For some reason I am craving a carmel apple now........
    20170708_223528 (Medium). 20170708_223536 (Medium). 20170708_232741 (Medium).
     
  3. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 9, 2017

    ahinkle wrote: Like a rocket! Do you paddle as hard as you build?

    In short bursts?
    Not sure :p


    As I feared the paper wasn't waxy enough and became part of the boat......

    I shaved as much of the extra off the opposite sides and finished off with a little palm sander.

    20170709_130650 (Medium).
    20170709_095526 (Medium). 20170709_100552 (Medium). 20170709_123547 (Medium).
    Got Landon involved in the first coat of epoxy.

    The panels seem pretty solid so I didn't put anything on top of this side.

    Got called into work so not sure if I'll get the molds cut out today or not.
    20170709_124424 (Medium). 20170709_124435 (Medium). 20170709_125612 (Medium).
    Got the 5 molds layed out on an old partial piece of osb. Since I had so many lines I used a sharp to mark around the cut lines. (Was paranoid I would cut one of them on the centerline on accident)

    Added 4 inches to the top of each mold so it will sit up a little when upside down.
    ...... just realized I need to read the plans more.... I'm not sure if those are all level or not.... I may have screwed up on that not sure yet.........

    I cut them out and sanded the edges smooth.
    20170709_213613 (Medium). 20170709_223611 (Medium).

    Question: How do you know where to drill the stitching holes?
     
  4. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 10, 2017

    I understand 6" or whatever increments I decide..... But how do i align them from panel to panel?????? They obviously have to match.

    I could use the 24" marks but they are straight where the panels curve........

    Centers working out measured along the curve?


    @BB Sig what do you mean by baseline? The fs17 and 19 plans I have show a baseline but the canoe doesn't.

    I think I should be safe starting 3 inches each side of the seams and working out from there in 6 inch increments. Then adding holes if I need at 3 on the ends.



    Honey doos kept me busy till 11 so not much progress to report :/

    I put some 40grit on my little palm sander and attacked the paper I bonded to the seam.

    Before: you can see there is paper embedded in the entire width of the resin......

    20170709_130650 (Medium).
    Mostly sanded off: you can see the paper areas look like voids in the resin but its really just the white of the paper.
    20170710_232342 (Medium).
    Done: ??? Good enough?
    20170710_232714 (Medium).


    Weather Report: 11:30pm 56f was warmer during the day.
    Still light enough in the tent to do rough work but not detailed. Lights ordered from Amazon for when it starts getting dark sooner in the evening.
    Picture taken at 11.30 without a flash. 20170710_233052 (Medium).
     
  5. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 11, 2017

    BB Sig wrote: After looking at the study plans, I don't think it was ever meant to be built with a jig. This is a true stitch and glue build. The molds are throw a ways made for getting the shape right. I would bet that the plans say to build right side up and to support the ends as necessary. That's how the FS13 is designed to be built. [​IMG]
    Let us know how Jacques meant it to be built...


    I think you are right. It's a bit confusing though. Perhaps because I've read through the fa17/19 plans so much I read more into these than was there. I had planned to build this upside down like they are glassing the bottom first. But it seems like it's to be done inside first right side up.
    It's confusing because the plans say order doesn't matter.

    Guess I will do some more sanding in the evenings and think about it.
    You say the binder string is supposed to be completely sanded off? I wondered about that..... the little fiberglass I have used before was woven tighter than that and didn't have a binder string. What are the differences and pros and cons?
    I assume this is the right tape as it's what BBC sent me.


    Thanks Jacques....
    There are no measurements in the plans for doing it on a jig.
    I cut the molds out but if I hard mounted them to my table I don't think heights would be right since there is no base measurement. Or is the bottom perfectly flat and I can measure from there?

    July 12, 2017

    No physical work on the canoe yesterday :/
    It was Prime day on amazon though, so got a 6" electric sander, a small router, and a thermometer which gives inside/outside readings for the tent.

    Read this in another thread and Sounds like it might be a good idea for me as well.

    terrulian wrote: Welcome, Stuart.
    This is a good time to use your side panels as a pattern to cut your rub rails.


    July 13, 2017

    pee wee wrote: The structural fiberglass we use on these boats is a biaxial weave, and they sew it together with plain thread so it is easier to handle and doesn't come unravelled. Once the epoxy is set there is no longer a function for those threads and since they sit proud of the surface the consensus is to sand them down, but stop short of sanding into the glass. Look for that cross-hatch pattern to emerge on the sanded surface. The woven fiberglass typically doesn't use those threads.

    I think the threads i see are under the glass.... I may have sanded too much on the one piece. You can see first picture is sanded completely to the wood on the edges yet the thread is still visable. The last two I think I did right where the 45/45 is visable?(more so on the last one)

    20170713_000618 (Medium). 20170713_000640 (Medium). 20170713_000725 (Medium).


    Weather report: was up to 80f today and smoggy from fires around the state.
    I opened up the tent doors after work and then did my honey doos for a few hours and by the time I made it back out there it wasn't too bad.

    Cut 12 strips 1.5" wide matching the curve of the top of the side panel to use as rub rails.
    Stared at it all thinking about it for a bit..... That's about all I got done tonight.

    Panels layed out so we can drill the holes and start putting it together tomorow or this weekend.

    The stacked chine panels match almost perfectly but the side panels are about 1/4" off from each other in places. Hopefully it's not enough to cause issues during assembly.

    Landon was pretty impressed with the sawdust and was wanting to collect as much as he could in a bowl to "put on the grass"........ Not sure why but he enjoys his little projects so why not?
    20170713_231035 (Medium). 20170713_231050 (Medium).
     
  6. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 14, 2017

    Weather report: was another hot day. But 9:20pm it's 64f a good working temp in the tent once I had the flaps open and aired out a bit. Looks a bit like rain.

    Many times I have seen it said here that the beauty of this type of building is that it is impossible to mess up too badly. Anything can be ground down and glasses over.

    Tonight I am reminded of a more famous quote.

    I told myself atleast 3 times going into this tonight not to do this even once started I remember telling myself not to do this........
    (I let the boat building guys on their forum guess a few times before someone figured out that I had drilled holes not just where the panels stitch together, but also along the top rail which did NOT need holes drilled ;/)

    20170714_211725 (Medium).
    Well that was fun! It looks like a boat now!!!!!
    Looks like I am having the same trouble bigyellowtractor is having with the chine panel not wanting to match the camber of station A.
    20170714_220939 (Medium). 20170714_221653 (Medium). 20170714_221711 (Medium). 20170714_223859 (Medium). 20170714_225925 (Medium). 20170714_234240 (Medium).

    Ends up I have to work tomorow so can't stay up too late messing with it tonight. Good enough it looks like something now [​IMG]

    Tomorow night I'll come up with a plan of attack....

    1. I still need to wrap tape around the edges of the molds to make sure they don't get glued in.
    2. Figure out how to secure the molds into place..... tape? Straps? Temp screws?
    3. Tape all the inside seams so epoxy doesn't drip through.
    4. Figure out how to support it all and turn it over.
    5. Figure out how to get a good gap between panels.
    6. Stare at it a few hours wondering what I'm about to screw up.
    7. Glue between all the zip ties.

    Will see how far down the list I get tomorrow night :p
     
  7. narfi

    narfi Lost

    Another good picture I missed last night.

    20170714_204938 (Medium).

    I'll think more about the sequence of events for screwing the molds in with 2bys
     
  8. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 16, 2017

    Spent an unbelievable amount of time getting the molds in and panels aligned to my satisfaction.

    Used nails between the zip ties to get a good gap.
    Used 2bys on the molds to secure them. Took a lot of work on the A molds but like mentioned elsewhere "It ain't going to the moon!"
    Used duct tape to pull the outside ends of the nails up or down in areas the panels weren't lining up. Then taped between everything on the outside.
    Spent so much time fighting the the molds I forgot to tape them :/

    Landon had fun playing with the zip ties I was cutting off that were too tight and needed replacing.

    Mixed up epoxy and wood flour. I've read peanut butter consistency and I think I was more of a peanut butter mixed with honey consistency...... If I got a huge glob on the mixing stick it could drip off but the amount I needed between zip ties and nails stayed on even inverted.

    Didn't get done till 12:15 And while light enough to see outside it was really dim in the tent and in the "compartment" holes between molds.

    I ended up using Landon's little play lantern I set in each bay as I glued those seams.

    4 pumps of resin and 2 of hardner with 6 huge heaped high plastic spoons of flour got all the chine seams done. I applied it with the end of the mixing stick then took the radiused end of a rubber Bondo scrapper thing to clean it up.

    Another 4 and 2 pumps almost finished the side seams and finished it off with a 2 and 1 that finishes the last bay of the side seams and then with a glove and finger put a bunch up inside the bow corners. (That is a tight area and will be interesting trying to glass.....)

    20170715_222929 (Medium). 20170715_222958 (Medium). 20170715_223548 (Medium).
    Morning looks ok.

    Have a sample of most of the seams glued.
    20170716_111007 (Medium). 20170716_111127 (Medium).

    One problem area near mold A the tape holding the nail came loose and the panels sprung back apart..... will have to figure out what I am going to do there.
    20170716_112312 (Medium). 20170716_112904 (Medium).



    That's my plan fuzz it already looks better with some glue over the seam.

    Today I cut all the zip ties and removed all the spacer nails.
    Then removed the duct tape from the outside and put duct tape on all the inside seams.

    Cleaned up and swept a bit then had Landon help me flip the canoe over upside down.

    Glued all the seams and filled all the holes excluding what the screws are attached to the molds.
    Built up the seams a the bow panels that weren't matching up perfectly. Can hopefully sand them down to attractive curves by the time I'm done.

    Tomorow I plan to start sanding all the edges to a good radius, pulling the screws and filling those holes. (Hopefully it will hold its shape now that everything is Glued?)


    Got an Air compressor from a coworker who doesn't have a shop anymore and wanted to get rid of it. Traded him a 1/2 gal epoxy kit I hadn't used for the model fs19 we were doing last winter for it. Now I can paint here instead of having to worry about dragging it across town to work to paint it.
    20170716_161329 (Medium). 20170716_161634 (Medium). 20170716_201315 (Medium). 20170716_211418 (Medium). 20170716_211444 (Medium). 20170716_211557 (Medium).
     
  9. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 17, 2017

    Thanks guys.
    Just not enough time in the day to go any faster and still stay up on work and family.... (wife was upset this weekend I wasn't quite getting that balance right :/ )

    Started sanding with my little palm sander. The 6" orbital hasn't arrived yet. Only got one chine done.... 3 more seams to go.

    Got the bow curves starting to take shape.

    Found one spot that I sanded through the glue along the chine.

    Big news... removed all the former screws and it held it's shape [​IMG]

    Filled the screw holes and the void in the seam I found.

    Made my first attempt at a sanding block for the 4" sticky paper I have. (Saw it here on the forum but forget who to give credit to)

    Weather report: 10pm 55f rained about 30 minutes this evening but was a nice day. Grilled at work for lunch with my coworkers.(monday/Friday summer tradition for us second summer in a row)

    20170717_212919 (Medium). 20170717_212935 (Medium). 20170717_215022 (Medium).
     
  10. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 22, 2017

    Got some toys in the mail. The rest of the Prime Day sale stuff from Amazon.
    6" sander, router, multitool, and indoor/outdoor thermometer.
    20170721_204320 (Medium).

    While I was unpacking Landon did a little (very little) sanding.
    20170721_203315 (Medium).

    The 6" sander made things much much easier and I got all the seams sanded and radiused and got the front and back looking pretty decently curved.

    There were a few voids in the glue seams so I finished the night off with a last tiny batch of Epoxy and wood flour to fill those holes and one last shaping of the front and back curves. (I am a little worried about them because they are so narrow that it's impossible to have a 1/2" radius for the tape and glass to go around.) 20170721_232542 (Medium).

    Hoping to do a quick sand in the morning and epoxy the tapes on.
    Then in the afternoon put the then cloth on while the morning application is still green.


    Weather report: another hot day probably up into the low 80s but by the time I made it out to the boat factory after getting the honey doos done it wasn't too bad.
    20170722_005923 (Medium).

    20170722_004350 (Medium).

    Pro tip: don't suggest to the lady of the house that maybe she shouldn't leave the cardboard boxes with your new tools in them out in a rainstorm before you get home.


    Even using the fast hardner last night it wasn't ready to sand this morning [​IMG]

    The leftovers I left on the Bondo spreader to make it easy to pull off and clean is about like thick taffy.
    Hopefully by 2 or 3 it will have heated up enough I can sand it and get started. Feeling like most of a day wasted :/ got up this morning eager to start taping and glassing.

    Need to find a better location for the outside temp sensor..... by 11 it was claiming 175f but was in direct sunlight......
    20170722_095121 (Medium). 20170722_095156 (Medium). 20170722_113246 (Medium).

    Well it's a cooker today.
    Hit over 90 in the shade and up over 100 in the boat factory.

    I've got it sanded and ready to tape but I wasn't expecting this heat so slowest epoxy I have is medium...... I'll wait till this evening and hopefully 70ish degrees to start. 20170722_161835 (Medium).

    (The end pieces of tape are cut and will put on after the chine and side pieces)

    I might put the 4oz on as soon as I'm done with the tapes..... will see how smooth the tapes look when I am done.

    What do you guys suggest for fairing? I was thinking of applying the first thin layer of light weight filler while the epoxie is still green(no longer gooey but not yet hard enough to sand) before any initial sanding. Is that a good or bad idea?
    The 4oz seems to be woven and doesn't have the rows of threads standing up, so it should be pretty smooth right away?



    I think I'm close Tom..... 7' in the shade outside you can just see the bottom of it in the picture. And 5.5' inside.
    20170722_174407 (Medium). 20170722_174717 (Medium). 20170722_174914 (Medium).

    You guys might not think it's much but I'm dying here!!!!
     
  11. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 23, 2017

    Started around 10pm and finished just after midnight.
    Me, wife and a friend of hers. (Landon did a little brushing and a lot of supervising)

    I'm not sure batch sizes but was doing 4 pumps of epoxy and 2 pumps of medium hardner per batch and 2 and 1 for half batches.

    Tapes were all pre cut and held in place with packing tape (seems I need to get some masking tape comming)

    I've they were on we rolled out the 4oz roll and cut it in place. Probably messed too much with getting it oriented just right I realized that the rub rails gave me that 1.5 inch on the edges I didn't need perfection.......

    Used brushes for the resin on the tapes and most of the 4oz was applied with the Bondo scrapper which worked really well then brushes working out bubbles and more scraping.

    I'm really happy with It, it looks great to my untrained eyes.
    There were a few spots with bubbles between the tapes and 4oz that I couldn't get worked out. Not sure how bad that is........ I know you don't want them but don't have any experience to judge them by.

    Plan if I wake up before it's too hot in the morning I'll put on a nice coat of filler then tomorow night if it's a scorcher like today it will be ready for sanding.

    20170722_215539 (Medium). 20170722_231427 (Medium). 20170723_004446 (Medium).
    20170723_004619 (Medium).
    20170723_001426 (Medium). 20170723_004338 (Medium).
    The supports aren't structural?

    I left those uncovered for fuzz.

    I wanted an excuse to use my new multitool.

    I thought with cool nights they would still be soft enough to cut them off in the morning with a Razer.

    Honestly? I'm an idiot.

    Maybe lazy?

    For sure I have a bad memory.......





    Well the broad strokes are done....... now I have to figure out how to detail O.o

    Box knife with a fresh blade cut the green edges off like a hot knife through butter. Things shouldn't be that easy!

    Mixed the mixed light weight filler 2 pumps of resin 1 pump of fast hardner and 5 plastic spoons heaped with filler used 6 spoons on the side panels as I couldn't just pour it out over it so used ~1ftx1ft piece of plywood to hold it on and cut what I needed off with the Bondo scraper.

    So..... how do I take it all back off?
    I have the 6inch sander the little palm sander and the board with handles I made..... what grit do I use?
    Any tips?
    20170723_120953 (Medium). 20170723_121108 (Medium). 20170723_121016 (Medium).
     

    Attached Files:

  12. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 24, 2017

    40grit on the board and a few hours of elbow grease.......
    Changed the paper once about 3/4 of the way through.

    20170724_074449 (Medium). 20170724_074516 (Medium).

    Brushed all the dust off and added filler between the tapes.

    I noticed sanding that I had noticeable dipps in the filler from digging in the Bondo scrapper. I tried harder to do full length single passes this time... not sure how successful I was but time will tell.....

    Hit the 1gal of epoxy mark so 1.5 gal of epoxy+hardner..... hopefully I'm not being too wasteful in my inexperience...
    (1/2 to 3/4 inch left in the bottom of first bottle I switched early because I didn't want the pump to suck air and throw off the mix. When this one is down a bit I'll pour that in with it.)
    20170724_074537 (Medium). 20170724_074556 (Medium).

    Finished at 1.30am but phone was dead and couldn't take final pictures till this morning.

    Question: Is there info on making paddles anywhere? I just realized at this rate Landon will have his undersized kayak paddle and I'll be swinging a 2x4 o.O

    Question 2: Is there any reason to sharpen the chines and side seams? Or are they ok rounded as is?
     
  13. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 24, 2017

    Thanks guys I'll read more up on those links.
    They do seem cheap.... but would still be fun to make them myself.......

    Started to sand tonight but it started balling up a little so I guess I got the night off. Temps were down and it rained off and on this afternoon. Guess at this temp range it needs a full 24hrs till I can sand [​IMG]

    Will see if I can catch up on sleep or get distracted with something else.
     
  14. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 26, 2017

    Did another round of sanding last night.

    20170726_070534 (Medium). 20170726_070555 (Medium).

    Applied more fairing material....
    This time I mixed it a little thinner and applied it MUCH thinner. I held the Bondo applicator almost 90° and pressed hard removing all I had applied except for the lows. Kind of an experiment for me as I don't know what I'm doing :p

    How do you guys apply fairing mix?
    20170726_070700 (Medium). 20170726_070726 (Medium).

    Temps were down again and it rained all day yesterday and last night so I expect I won't be able to sand till tomorow night. (Besides my body can't take repetitive sanding sessions so late into the night/morning.... don't think I am as young as I used to be [​IMG] )
    Plan is to try a little finer grit this time. Been using 40grit so maybe 80 grit now, I forget what sizes I had bought. 20170726_070801 (Medium).
     
  15. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 26, 2017

    Thanks guys!
    Still having fun, though wife says i cant keep staying up that late.
    Then boss told me we have a plane coming in tonight that needs done by morning o.0

    I just noticed in my pictures that my thermometer has the right time but shifted 12hrs..... I need to change the AM/PM on it around.
     
  16. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 27, 2017

    Sanded the edges where filler beaded up when applying it. It seemed to gum up the paper some which made it difficult. Then I switched to 80grit paper and started sanding the flat areas and it gummed up right away.

    I stopped for the night and will try again tomorow.
    It's been 2 days since I applied it.... hoping it's just the cooler temps and I didn't mix it poorly. It did get warm today but was cold and damp yesterday and when I was applying it......

    20170727_220758 (Medium). 20170727_220818 (Medium).




    Marinepoxy and fast hardner.
    First batch was 4pumps epoxy and 2 pumps hardner mixed then stired in filler. Second and third batches were 2pumps and 1hardner.

    I had expected after baking this afternoon it would be good to go as well which has me worried I mixed it poorly or something. It acts just like it did before at 20hrs of cool temps and that was fine to sand after another day.

    Guess I'll know the answer tomorow night :/
     
  17. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 28, 2017

    I like that I can bake it during the day and it still cools down within an hour or so to human working conditions within an hour or so of opening it up [​IMG]

    Well either it's almost sanded enough or I'm just tired of sanding........

    I'm happy with the bottom and chine panels. No low spots on them. The side panels will probably need one more pass of fairing...... my back said enough was enough tonight though.

    It's awkward sanding the side panels that low. I think tomorow I'll flip it up right again and see if that's any easier. Maybe put the rub rails on and finish the inside a bit more to get it more rigid as well.

    Then I'll come back and sand with finer grid to get the scratch marks out and decide if I need to do more or not.

    20170728_224600 (Medium).
     
  18. narfi

    narfi Lost

    July 30, 2017

    Didn't get much done on the canoe today.
    Went across the lake with a friend of Landon's and ate some hotdogs and marshmallows and explored the rocks.
    (Found a pile of moose bones scattered around. No meat left on them but they looked fresh)

    Honey doos kept me busy for the afternoon then had to work a few hours this evening on a float plane. Looks like I'll be working tomorow as well :/

    Did a little more sanding and then scrounged up an old pipe to cut for clamps. I wondered if it was old enough to be brittle but it seems to have plenty of "spring" left in it.

    Dummied up the first layer of rubrail to see how it would fit and called it a night.

    20170730_001212 (Medium). 20170730_001238 (Medium). 20170730_001400 (Medium). 20170730_001442 (Medium). 20170730_001510 (Medium). 20170730_001548 (Medium). 20170730_001617 (Medium). 20170730_001702 (Medium).

    Got all 3 layers fitted this morning and then my wife helped hold each strip in place as I clamped them.

    I was surprised at how well it held the sides to their appropriate spacing. I only needed to clamp it to the formers in 3 or 4 spots furthest from the camera. All the sides close to the camera were near perfect for width so I didn't even clamp the formers there they are just sitting there for my visual measurements.

    Finished at 1.35 this afternoon..... was supposed to be at work at 1.30.... oops.
    20170730_143458 (Medium). 20170730_143521 (Medium).
    Glue was cured solid when I got home from work so I removed all the clamps and pulled the formers out.

    Alot of mess to clean up inside before I can glass.
    Guess I wasn't careful enough when spot welding and taping the inside before filling the outer seams.
    20170730_215636 (Medium).

    I tried knocking them down with the 6" but that just tore up the edges of the paper. So I've started using the palm sander with 40grit on it. It's slow going but seems to be working. Got maybe 1/4 to 1/3rdish done.
    20170730_215742 (Medium). 20170730_215724 (Medium).

    I'm still confused about my fairing compound curing issues......
    Straight epoxy cures as fast as I expect.
    Epoxy with wood flour as glue cures as fast and can be sanded without excessive curing time.
    But when mixed with the mixed filler from BBC it takes a few days even at elevated temperatures and even then still clogs up the paper some.
    Is there something in it that floats to the top that clogs the paper?
    Jason mentioned having the same issue with his.....
    The point of the mixed filler is to be light weight and easy to sand, right?
    If it's not easy to sand would something else be better?
    The wood flour mix cures quickly how does it sand for fairing?
     
  19. narfi

    narfi Lost

    August 2, 2017

    Did some more sanding inside last night, almost done with prepping for interior glassing. Hope to finish the prep tonight.

    I wanted to do a layer of 4oz over the interior like I did on the outside, but imagine it will be even more difficult to layout without wrinkles etc... Would doing it in several pieces side to side the width of the cloth(50" overlapped by an inch or so) be bad?

    The rubrails...... Lots of highs and lows from layer to layer, I had just cut them roughly to the shape of the top of the side panels before anything was assembled. Assuming I could clean it up later........
    My thought is to use a little epoxy/wood flour to fill the lows on the top and then a small hand plainer to take down the highs and smooth it all out. (I have never used a hand plainer before but have one coming from amazon)
    Then when the top has a nice smooth and fair looking surface use a 1/2" radius router bit to round over the corners. (I have never used a router either o.0)
    Is this a good approach to making the rubrail look nice? I think doing this I can make the top look near perfect, and if I round under the bottom properly it will give the rail a uniform height and not look wavy?

    The little palm sander I have been using is hook n latch or whatever that is called, but I didn't have any new pads for it, I have just been sticking the sticky back strips I have in rolls over the last pad on it and then cutting it to fit which has worked pretty well so far, but that finally deteriorated enough i pulled it off last night. Any thoughts for sticking sticky back paper to latch n hook type pads?


    So I finished sanding the excess glue on the inside seams and decided I'd glass inside tonight.
    20170802_224254 (Medium).
    Layed fillets of epoxy/wood flour on all the inside seams using the Bondo scraper bent to a curve. The ends I filled with the mixing sticks/tounge depresses and was surprised it turned out pretty decent for as tight a corner it is.
    20170802_224319 (Medium).

    I layed the tapes down and gently patted them onto the fillets to hold in place. Then wife and I brushed them all down with epoxy. We also "primed" all the bare wood with epoxy.
    20170802_224358 (Medium).

    Then we layed down 3x 50" widths of 4oz sideways and I used the Bondo scraper to spread epoxy around on them. Started with the center one then did the two ends. Struggled with getting it to lay down well quite a bit, but in the end it's "good enough for who it's for"
    20170802_224454 (Medium).

    Weather report: 11pm 60f and raining (I used medium speed hardner for epoxy and fillets)
     
  20. narfi

    narfi Lost

    August 3, 2017

    I agree. It's because I was fighting that top layer to lay down without wrinkling. There is a bit of an optical delusion there as well..... there is less than one foot without the extra layer at each end but the angle of the camera makes it look like the closest 1/4 of the canoe is more than 1/2 the length.

    20170803_092044 (Medium).

    I got up this morning and fried up some bacon sausage and eggs and a cup of coffee. Then headed out and trimmed the excess cloth off the edges and applied a layer of fairing mix over it all.
    Experimented with the back radiused edge of the Bondo spreader in the corners and realize I should have done that with the fillets under the tape, it worked very well.

    20170803_092102 (Medium).

    55f and raining......

    I knew it would be a slow day in the hangar so an hour late to work isn't bad :p


    Filled the tops of the rub rails.
    20170803_224457 (Medium).

    Converted my Velcro palm sander to take sticky back paper.
    Cut the new pad out of an old children's puzzle piece floor mat and attached it with longer screws through it and the original pad since the original holds the bearing for the eccentric vibrator shaft. 20170803_224615 (Medium). 20170803_224639 (Medium). 20170803_224717 (Medium).

    Then cut a new softer more flexible sanding board with 1/4" plywood and bonded handles and a strip of the same foam to it. (Will find out how well the epoxy bonds to the foam it's an experiment)
    20170803_224741 (Medium).
     

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